DAVE HANCOX: We're going to talk a little bit about our Minnesota experience and one thing I want to give a couple of quick disclaimers up front here before we get started. 

First you know you've heard at least myself you have heard us talk and some of the other presenters, you have heard us talk about the good relationships that we have with our VR group in our state and Abbie is here with me now to share in this presentation and I want you to know that for those of you who might be sitting in the audience, going how in the world-this is just impossible, we haven't been able to do that in our state, et cetera. 

I want you know it wasn't always that way in Minnesota either and I'm sure the other states that have been featured here today would say the same thing. 

It's a relationship again, that we have had to work on and cultivate and come to the table multiple times and part of what we're going to talk about in our presentation this afternoon will give you some examples of how we went about cultivating that relationship because we tried numerous times in Minnesota and it didn't work. 

And sometimes it takes just getting the right people to the table and I mean the right people from both sides because let's face it on the IL side we can be a little stubborn, too. 

Just like we can accuse the folks on the VR side of being a little stubborn and set in their ways. 

We can be, too. 

So it really does take many years sometimes of effort and focus and cultivation and time and attention to bring about these very successful relationships. 

And I'm very, very happy to say, and I know that Abbie will back me up on this, that we have been able to do that in Minnesota and we're very, very proud of that. 

That's one thing I wanted to share with you is if you don't have that relationship yet with, between VR and IL in your state, don't give up on it. 

Keep working at it. 

It just takes that continual effort and, just like any other relationship in your life, it takes time and attention and effort and cultivating it and so forth. 

The other thing I wanted to say is what you're going to see in our slides, we're going to talk largely about the IL VR relationship that we have been able to cultivate in Minnesota and the benefits and the product that it's produced. 

But I wanted to relate it to the subject of transition as well because in these slides you may not see a whole lot about transition, but there is two things that I want you to remember is that what we have right now in Minnesota is a very, very successful IL VR collaboration and we're going to evidence that for you in this slide show. 

And that's a real thing right now. 

We're in our seventh year of this collaboration project getting ready to start our eighth and it's going to keep going. 

We all know that. 

The other thing that we have in place right now through the Metro Center for Independent Living as you saw earlier is that we have successfully embedded transition staff in the public school systems, in five different public school systems around the Metro area. 

So that's another real success. 

The next steps for us, and again you're going to see some of that evidenced here, but I just want to say this as a bit of a disclaimer the next steps for us is to use the very successful IL VR collaboration that we're about to share with you and expand it by adding a transition focus within it and also taking our already embedded IL or our already embedded transition focus in the public schools and moving it to a more exact fee-for-service program. 

We've established the value of it in the last three or four years. 

What we're ready to do now is go back to the school districts, use that value that they've already placed on it, and allow that to move us into a fee-for-service relationship. 

So my point in giving you those disclaimers is that this is an evolutionary process. 

Our relationships with the schools didn't start at a fee-for-service level. 

Our relationships with the schools started by building trust, providing services, creating relationships. 

Again, that cultivation of those relationships and moving forward. 

So we're ready to move into that next step now of moving our transition, our very successful transition program into a fee-for-service contract. 

So I wanted to make sure that I gave you those, or shared those qualifiers with you as we move forward. 

So in Minnesota we got together and we identified that the vocational rehabilitation services and the Minnesota Association of Centers for Independent Living agreed to develop a substantial collaboration between centers and VRS. 

And the purpose or the vision for this collaboration was to build local service capacity and mutual partnership to advance the employment and independent living of Minnesota people who require both vocational rehabilitation and independent living to achieve their goals for working and living in the community. 

While this statement certainly identifies the values of this collaboration, I think it also speaks to a historical context. 

We were talking about this at the table during the break. 

For those of you who are well versed in the IL history, you'll know that back in the early 70's when the independent living movement was created, when it was first started by Ed Roberts and Judy Heumann and other folks, it was not done with the intent to create a hostile relationship between IL and VR. 

It was created as a parallel. 

It was created as an alternative service for individuals with disabilities that was complementary. 

Because they recognized even then that the two had to coexist, that in order for somebody to have a truly successful VR experience, they needed good IL skills. 

And for somebody to have a really meaningful independent living opportunity in their life, that employment was part of that. 

So they were really established even really on in the very beginning to be a parallel, not to be combative. 

I understand how the combative nature evolved, but we have to move back away from that. 

We have got to find, remember what grandma said, what did grandma say? 

We're all in this alone together. 

See, they're listening. 

So a statewide planning meeting occurred in 2007 between the VRS staff and the center staff to identify statewide issues and unmet needs that can be addressed through a collaboration. 

Our VR director in the state of Minnesota, her name is Kim Peck, she brought us all together in a hotel conference room like this in June of 2007 and she put a challenge on the table in front of us. 

She said I want all the CIL directors and all the VR local directors, we call them RAMs in our state, the Regional Area Managers, to go back to their home communities and I want you to come up with a unique plan for your community on how we can meet the collective needs of our shared customers. 

Well, on the IL side, the first question asked on the IL side is how much are you going to pay us for that? 

That was the first question. 

And she said, you know what, there is no answer to that question. 

There is no set dollar amount. 

I'm not offering you a grant. 

There is no set dollar amount. 

I want you to go back, have a conversation and come back to me and say, this is what we came up with as a plan to meet our needs and we'll see if we can fund it. 

She told us that she had an exact dollar amount that she was willing to put on the table. 

So we all went back to our home communities. 

We started to have this dialogue. 

The dialogue and exploration that resulted in the submission of eight unique collaborative plans. 

And every one, there are eight centers in Minnesota, and every one of those eight plans looked uniquely different. 

Uniquely different. 

We had one center, a rural center that submitted a plan to hire one staff person and literally hang out their shingle and advertise the availability of their services to the VR counselors. 

The other end of the spectrum was my center where we identified hiring six individuals that we would embed in the workforce development centers. 

Okay? So it was all over the place. 

The first three years we operated this as a pilot project. 

So each collaborative proposal was defined by the local needs and it had to be approved and signed off both by the IL and VR staff. 

So when it came to the table, it had to be clearly evidenced to that collaboration. 

So how it works now, once we got those funded, the first three years were a pilot project. 

How it works now, the IL needs are assessed during the intake process, simultaneous to the consumer's VR needs. 

So this is happening simultaneously. 

We have our IL specialist, now we have nine of them, that are embedded in the workforce centers. 

So they are working side by side with the VR counselor to do this initial intake. 

The services occur simultaneously in a parallel fashion. 

So we're addressing both the VR and IL needs at the same time. 

Progress and outcomes are reported in workforce 1 and internal database. 

So we have a collective data collection point as well. 

Frequent and regular communication is critical between the IL specialist and the VR counselor to ensure appropriate progress and reporting. 

And the critical piece is the collocation, creating immediacy of availability. 

MCIL staff are embedded at the workforce centers as an integral part of that team. 

That was a condition place order this collaboration by the VR counselors. 

They said it's not as valuable to us unless, there is an immediacy of availability. 

That right now availability, they have to be there. 

ABBIE WELLS HERZOG: Can I speak too that? 

DAVE HANCOX: Yes, I wish you would. 

ABBIE WELLS HERZOG: I can remember I was a counselor in the field when this occurred and up to that point I think we had some IL staff come in occasionally and help. 

But we found it wasn't enough because sometimes things would come up and they couldn't regularly keep an appointment because they were spread pretty thin. 

So having this person in the office, it just made so much more sense because for a lot of reasons but one of the reasons is many Minnesota we made the decision several years ago that every high school in Minnesota has a vocational rehab counselor attached to it, assigned to provide services to that high school. 

And so in this way we were kind of duplicating that same thing that there would be consistency, that the IL staff would be there for us. 

But I will say when it first was brought up that we're going to have somebody, we were kind of like, what? 

What are we going to do with this person? 

What are we going to do with them? 

They are going to be here four days a week, what will we do? 

And I'll let you speak to it. 

DAVE HANCOX: They are going to be in the way. 

It was interesting because it was the VR counselors that say somebody shows up here and we do that initial intake and we identify they have independent living skill needs and we say can you come back next Tuesday? 

There is no guarantee that the consumer is going to come back. 

So that availability has to be immediate, it has to be right now. 

So the VR project funding originally was a request for proposal process. 

Again, those first three years was a pilot project and at the end of those three years, because that's the way the federal dollars that were available. 

At the end of those three years on the VR side on the funding side, they reassessed and said okay of these eight models that we've seen that have been demonstrated around the state, which one is really meeting the needs that we have for serving the shared consumer base? 

And it was decided that the mechanism that we had created at Metro center, that the idea of embedding the IL staff in the workforce center was the one that best met the need. 

So that became the model for the rest of the state. 

So when we started that fourth year and now we're finishing our seventh, the fourth through the seventh year that became the model to replicate. 

We're very proud of that. 

We used VR, I'll let you speak to this, and VR and Social Security program income to fund the project and funding was defined by local needs rather than a prescribed dollar amount. 

So what we see happening, and you'll see a chart here a couple of slides ahead, is that we're not uniformly funded. 

The grant that we received at the Metro center is almost $550,000. 

There is a center that serves a largely rural, a completely rural population 

that doesn't have the population base that we have, et cetera, and their grant 

that they receive is mid 40's, like 45,000, or $46,000. 

So there is a widespread, but again, it's based on that identify local need. 

The first three years as a have I mentioned was a time limited demonstration project. 

I think we covered these points. 

Collaborators were given considerable latitude to define the scope of services. 

In those first three years, we had among the eight projects, you know, again, we embedded staff. 

We had other centers that made their focus transition age. 

They made their focus a different context within the IL model. 

A wide variety of services and models were submitted. 

In year four we had a significant change because we had a decline in program income. 

We had a looming state budget crisis. 

We were refocusing the collaboration, so for that fourth year we started out with only funding for nine months because that was the year we went through with the, not only on the state level, but the feds when they were reclaiming some of the dollars, what did they call it, reallotment when the state and federal governments were going through a lot reallotment. 

The emphasis starting in year four was on collocation and we were targeting largely VRS consumers. 

There had to be that to be able to continue to tap the available dollars, we had to identify those customers that were a shared customer base. 

Later on, in year five, we got through that period of financial instability. 

And the funding became available to continue all eight of the collaborations. 

We continued the collocation as the model and services to VRS consumers. 

The impact and effectiveness on collaboration becomes apparent in increased employment outcomes. 

What we're able to show now by data that we collaboratively collect is that for consumers who come to the workforce centers and participate in the IL VR collaboration, that are receiving those parallel services, we have a 67 percent success rate of employment outcomes. 

It's pretty good. 

Compared to individuals who come to the workforce center who do not participate in the collaboration but get just straight VR services, the success rate is running 54 percent. 

So we know it's having an impact. 

Right? 

The other impact that it's having is that it has brought the two communities together in a really collaborative way and we have VR counselors now in the workforce centers that are saying you cannot take this away from us. 

Having the IL staff here is an essential part of our service delivery. 

You cannot take this away. 

The VR and IL staff recognize that collaboration is both highly helpful and essential and key legislators see the positive impact on consumer success and support continuation of the collaboration. 

Used to be that we would go to our legislative support and say, you know, we're getting treated so badly by VR and VR would go and say we're having such a tough time to get IL come to the table to talk to us that we can't be friends. 

And of course legislators would say don't put us in the middle of this range war. 

You have to figure this relationship out on your own and come back to us. 

Now we're able to go back to the legislature and say look at this wonderful success, this incredible collaboration that we've created here and the legislators are saying, boy, we love it. 

We love it because now you're coming in here direct, coming in here to us to talk to us collaboratively and collectively so that we can have a uniform conversation with you. 

The legislators say it used to be in the past where I was afraid if I gave support to the Independent Living Centers, that I was going to get in trouble with VR or if I gave support to VR I would get in trouble with IL. 

Now there is no longer a divide and conquer and we come in together and mutually support each other and it makes the legislators more willing and desirous to support our collective work. 

So now we have year six and today now we have eight locally developed collaborations that exist. 

Collocation or alternative collocation models are part of every collaboration. 

The tracking and reporting systems are in place and this is a tracking and reporting system that both sides contribute to. 

And we can both extrapolate that data out. 

So VR uses it for their annual reports. 

We can also access that data and extrapolate it and put it into our 704 reports. 

So there is a collective reporting of this data as well. 

Data is collected on a quarterly basis and evaluation and monitoring is conducted annually. 

Again, make no mistake, this is a fee-for-service product because it is performance-based. 

On the IL side if we stop performing, if we're not creating those outputs as well as outcomes, then dollars stop. 

This is a fee-for-service program. 

It's performance-based. 

You can see some of the funding history here in 2007, 2008. 

We allocated about $1.3 million total and I think each year I think what VR is capable of putting on the table is about 1.5. 

So we underspend every year. 

And you see here the low point where we had only nine months worth of funding. 

But a lot of the centers have stayed fairly consistent in what they've requested. 

MCIL Metro center is the second line right here across. 

So we stay pretty consistent as well. 

This program, this collaboration on the part of the Metro Center for Independent Living, it allows us to serve between 1,000 and 1,200 people that we otherwise would very, very likely not see on an annual basis. 

So we're wrapping up our seventh year. 

That's 7 or 8,000 people that have received services through our center 

that we might not have otherwise been connected to. 

I think that's worth it. 

I think that's pretty valuable. 

Did you want to say anything? 

I'm rambling. 

ABBIE WELLS HERZOG: Remember the number part. 

That was our agreement. 

DAVE HANCOX: Yes, absolutely. 

During the demonstration phase, the 2008-2010 this conversation, this challenge took place in June of 2011. 

We actually started our first projects January of 2008. 

So it ran on a calendar basis and then that nine months clip that we talked about earlier allotted us to shift it into the federal fiscal year. 

So now it runs on a federal fiscal year. 

But during that demonstration phase, VRS and the centers didn't share a common reporting system that could dependably track the services and outcomes. 

We've corrected that now. 

Quarterly reports from the centers and the experience of the VR counselors suggested a positive impact on the consumers but we didn't have the hard data. 

And we all know how important that is. 

ABBIE WELLS HERZOG: On the, back when we didn't have a combined reporting system, what they did was they depended on the counselors to put in when we used IL services. 

So I don't know about you guys, but we have a lot of paperwork and so I would suspect it was greatly under reported how much, how many referrals were made. 

Cause that's really what we look at is how many referrals and what kind of services that we're referring for and we'll talk about that in a few minutes. 

DAVE HANCOX: Great. 

In 2011 VRS and the centers implemented a concurrent reporting system that I mentioned a moment ago, that showed the potential impact of the collaboration on increasing employment outcomes. 

So since 2011 we've had that. 

So some of the service examples in the project, again, as our other two colleagues have shared with you, we do a lot of school to work transitions. 

So getting, getting individuals ready for that transition to work, those soft skills. 

Getting to work on time, interpersonal skills, you've got to be able to get along with your co-workers, right? 

Personal hygiene, huge one. 

Huge one, personal hygiene. 

Things like that. 

Pre-employment preparation, job hunting skills, we do, I think somebody else mentioned I think Peter you guys might have mentioned that you do mock interviews and things like that. 

We not only do the mock interviews, but we videotape them so we can play them back and we can have conversations, you might want to answer this question differently or remember to look at the person when they're talking to you. 

You know by videotaping it you can roll play it back. 

We help people with drafting their resumes, how to do an online job search as well as a newspaper job search. 

How to identify your field of interest that you want to work in. 

We also serve persons with mental illness, ASD and veterans. 

Employment related ADA issues are part of the service that is delivered in this collaboration. 

Nonvocational skills that are necessary for success, again, those soft skills, it's not uncommon for somebody to come to the workforce center that we identify as needing vocational supports, but also needing IL skills development that also are having housing issues. 

How can you expect somebody to do an effective job search, obtain and retain meaningful employment if they don't know where they're going to sleep that night. 

So one of the values that we bring to it with our housing search and our housing services is addressing some of those nonemployment but employment impacting kind of issues. 

You know, it might be housing. 

It might be transportation. 

It might be the person is not getting three squares a day. 

It might be that dysfunctional family that you talked about earlier that we can get some counseling in place for that. 

We've even gone into the youth programs in the Metro area that serve homeless youth. 

I remember the first time I went into one of the programs in downtown Minneapolis that was serving homeless youth and about 63 percent of the population in that homeless youth center were kids with disabilities. 

And I said to the young counselor that I was walking in with, I said boy they are going the eat me alive. 

He goes, why do you say that? 

I said, I'm a middle-aged white guy from the suburbs, what do I know about living on the streets? 

They are going to eat me alive. 

He says, the only reason they would eat you alive is if you pretend to be anything but that middle aged white guy from the suburbs. 

If you don't try to be anything but that you'll be fine. 

And we got along okay. 

We do bus training. 

We used the project to connect young people and young adults to other resources that perhaps county services, county case management services, housing, we helped them with their, we have a DB101 program that is connected to the Disability Linkage Line. 

It is Disability Benefits 101. 

We can take the person online and do a complete review and assessment of their benefits package. 

Are they getting everything they are entitled to? 

Are there other supports out there they are not aware of yet. 

It's a wonderful online tool that people have found very, very valuable. 

We get people connected to health care. 

You know, if they're battling some kind of continual medical issue or something, that's impeding their ability to obtain and retain employment as well. 

Social services, applications for state I.D, Social Security cards, et cetera. 

So the IL specialist can spend a lot of time dealing with these. 

Again, they are nonemployment, but they are employment impacting kind of issues that a VR counselor doesn't really have the time or inclination to deal with because it's not in their wheel house. 

The IL specialist can take that and work simultaneously or parallel with that VR counselor to get those needs met. 

ABBIE WELLS HERZOG: I wanted to comment on a couple of things. 

I've been with voc rehab for 14 years in Minnesota and I have seen over the last 14 years is the number of counselors has been decreasing. 

So people will retire and we won't replace them. 

And our case loads are getting a little higher. 

I don't know if other VR people here are experiencing that, but we are in Minnesota. 

We're also on an order of selection right now so our resources are really tight. 

What we're finding is through the IL staff, they are doing so many of the things that we used to do and now with our larger case loads they are really taking the pressure off of us and they take, if somebody needs an outfit for an interview tomorrow, oftentimes Analize can say, yep, I can take them and she will take them shopping for an interview outfit. 

Or I know this one young man the county kept losing his application for wavered services. 

So our wonderful Kelly, back when she was our IL staff, she seriously applied with this young man three times, filled out the whole form three times and finally she just walked it over to the county headquarters and dropped it off. 

We don't have time to do stuff like that. 

It would be lovely if we could, but we can't. 

And so having that extra support there has just, it's allowed us to do more of the vocational actual counseling and less of the running around kinds have things. 

DAVE HANCOX: a couple of individuals that Abbie just mentioned are on our IL VR collaboration teams. 

We wanted to introduce you to Jordan. 

He is one of the young man, transition age young man who has actually participated in our IL VR collaboration services and we thought you might like to hear it from him rather than continuing to hear it from me. 

VIDEO: When Jordan Feldick was a student at Simley High 

School in Inver Grove Heights, he liked to file reports about student life, music, and sports for the Spartan Spotlight. 

He also swam for the school swim team. 

He is graduated now but still pays attention to current events and thinks he might like to be a reporter some day. 

For now, he is a lifeguard at a local YMCA exploring several other job prospects and thinking seriously about enrolling in college to enhance his career options. 

He lives at Lincoln Place, a residence in Eaton for young people who are at risk of homelessness make the transition to adulthood. 

JORDAN FELDICK: Basically, me and my dad could not get along, he was a bit of an alcoholic at the time. 

And, he put me on the street. 

I was originally diagnosed with Aspergers when I was 15. 

I was reevaluated March of my senior year. 

I believe they came to the conclusion that I was not quite low functioning enough to be Aspergers, but I was still on the Autism spectrum. 

A little socially awkward, not entirely, in other words they pretty much came to the conclusion that I was gonna need some help. 

Thankfully, I did get some help, because I don't know if I would be where I am now without it so. 

IL VR SPECIALIST: Jordans life had so many different pieces, transportation, housing, the MA, obviously gaining employment, school, so there has been a lot of things to discuss at times. 

There is a lot of networking between different agencies and everything else and is just very complicated. 

So kind of pieced together over the last couple of months, quite a few meetings. 

Bring in an ILS worker, in my view is a way of kind of taking an employment plan that is really trying to help out these individuals with a disability succeed, kind of with a holistic approach, you know, because there are so many other areas that creates much more difficulties. 

There is all, like a multitude of different problems that come up that kind of assist with, try to make sure the living situation and everything else is stable enough to you know, to gain employment and maintain employment. 

VR COUNSELOR: Our goal is just kind of the job goal, but then, you know a lot of times people need more help than just finding a job 

It is just a lot of the little things that need taking care of that MCIL is there, you know, and I can refer to Butch and talk to him about a particular client and see if that is a good fit. 

IL VR SPECIALIST: It has been great. 

I have learned a lot from them, hopefully I have been able to share something with them. 

JORDAN FELDICK: More than anything I am just lucky to be getting the help that I am getting and there are people who are working together to help people in my situation and that I know a lot of, I have known some kids who have been in worse situations than me that never got any help. 

And I am just grateful more than anything. 

If it was not for the help of these guys I would probably be still living with a friend or I would probably be on the streets so, saying I am lucky is an understatement. 

ANNOUNCER: That is how it works. 

Career counseling and practical independent living skills a collaboration that helped Jordan achieve a self sufficiency and stability and ultimately to embark on his journey to an education, a career, and independence. 

DAVE HANCOX: So on this next chart as you can see I mentioned earlier, the overall outcome rate for 2013 is 66.5 percent for those people that participated in the collaboration, 58.5 percent for all other consumers. 

And then this is in your PowerPoints so I won't stay on this slide a long time, 10 minutes-thank you Judith. 

And this also is in your handouts, but it just shows the number of individuals that we've provided services to. 

Obviously we don't have the 2014 data yet because we haven't finished our contract year yet. 

That's the end of September. 

You can see the number of individuals we've been serving over the years and the total hours, the unduplicated totals. 

The total number of individuals served in the different service categories so it's really been very, very gratifying. 

So far just for 2011-2012, 23,508 service hours, 2,810 unduplicated totals for individuals served and et cetera. 

So, again, the numbers are proving themselves to be very successful. 

In responses to the survey from the VRS staff, if they are an accurate reflection of the VR staff perception, all field staff received a survey and a sufficient proportion responded to allow a generalization of all VRS staff. 

A moderate to high response proportion, 76 percent of VRS staff responded to this satisfaction survey. 

Overall, about 90 percent of the VRS staff indicated they strongly agree or agree that the collaboration was successful and on the six survey items assessing the communication and coordination collaboration, at least 70 percent of VRS staff responded that almost always or often good communication or coordination occurred. 

Do you want to add? 

ABBIE WELLS HERZOG: Having that person in our office just makes all the difference. 

[And having, knowing that I can walk somebody down the hallway. 

I'm the autism specialist for voc rehab for the state of Minnesota and I still have a small case load and it's really nice that I can often, if our local IL person in our office, her name is Analise, I can just walk one of my clients down and introduce them to Analise and then often she'll just set up an appointment right there and so before they get out the door and won’t E-mail or won't call back, she has got an appointment with them. 

And then all the IL staff I think are really great at reminding, sending E-mails, calling people to remind them about their appointments, especially with some of the folks that have some of the executive functioning issues that might forget or things like that. 

I think one of the things that, the information and the statistics from the data says IL, the IL project is just really appreciated by staff across the state. 

It's just made a huge, huge difference to the counselors and our support staff. 

DAVE HANCOX: and I think what Abby just said is supported on this slide, too, 90 percent of VR staff indicated that almost always or often their knowledge of IL increased and that consumer has benefited. 

That's impressive as well. 

The VR staff who experienced collocation of CIL staff were more likely to have a positive perception of the collaboration. 

Again, VRS staff experienced in the collocation were almost unanimous, 99 percent, 99 percent almost always or often perceived the consumer and VRS staff benefited from the collaboration. 

ABBIE WELLS HERZOG: And you don't get 99 percent of voc rehab counselors agreeing on anything. 

DAVE HANCOX: Just in a quick summary because I have another clip I want to share with you. 

Just in summary, the purpose was to advance the employment and independent living of Minnesota people who required both VR and IL to achieve that employment, independent living and community integration. 

The funding is VRS program income funds. 

The past efforts, yes, as we said here we've tried and tried and tried. 

We learned and now we're back with a better collaborative and invested plan because we were able to get both sides to the table for that really good conversation that resulted. 

The service needs are transition age, pre-employment, ADA issues and soft skills. 

The target population is deed and shared VRS consumers. 

Service delivery is staffed or collocated in the VR offices and/or are readily available on a regular basis. 

From 2011 to 2013, 2810 VR consumers received IL services in the collaboration. 

That's just in those two years. 

A total of 23,508 hours of service was provided. 

Because remember in 2011 was when we were able to create that collaborative, data collecting system. 

I'm tripping over my own tongue. 

ABBIE WELLS HERZOG: And then you mentioned about the transition age and how it might not, this might not be focusing on transition, but in Minnesota for about ten years we have been focusing on transition and our goal was to serve at least 20 percent of the students in the state of Minnesota who have IEPs and we reached that a few years ago. 

So we are very transition focused. 

DAVE HANCOX: And what we're hoping to do as a springboard from that success on the VR side is that as we start our next cycle with this particular project starting October 1, is that we want to add some transition staff and hours to the VR IL collaboration so that we have not only the IL specialist now embedded in the workforce centers, but we'll also have transition specialists there as well in  addition to using that experience as a springboard to pursue that fee-for- service connection with the schools. 

We already have the staff embedded in the schools. 

The next step is to get them to pay for it. 

You go in and create the value. 

You let them know how good the soup tastes and you threaten to take the bowl away if they don't pay for it. 

So again this is a collaboration. 

It's not a competition. 

Right? 

And I'm going to jump by this and again you can read it and it's the statute. 

So you don't need me to read it to you anyway, but I wanted to make sure we got to Matt because I wanted you to hear his story as well. 

Thank you. 

VIDEO: Matthew Collins is in his mid 30s and a first year student at Anoka-Ramsey Community College. 

Education was not his top priority when he came to the vocational rehabilitation program. 

He wanted a technology job, but it was not that simple. 

Largely self taught, he had plenty of practical technical experience but no real credentials. 

Those require education, training. 

But he had a load of debt from a previous college loan, recurring health problems, housing and transportation issues, plus a lot of practical questions about how to proceed. 

MATTHEW COLLINS: I have had panic disorder for a long time. 

A little over a decade, I was diagnosed quite a few years ago. 

Kind of struggled keeping jobs. 

There was a period there where I was pretty much agoraphobic, I could not, for three or four years there, I could not leave my apartment. 

During that time of course, I had to try and find work online so I got some odd jobs here and there doing contract work creating video tutorials, I mentioned that, making little flash applications and things like that for people. 

Some other medical stuff kicked in and then I had a more difficult time for awhile. 

But as I have been feeling better, I just had to come in and check out voc rehab again and this time they had the collaboration with IL. 

Yeah, so everything has been working pretty good, started going back to school. 

At the end there I was meeting with {size:14} {size:12}Kallie and going straight over to Halley like, you know, one right after the other. 

I think at that time, it was a couple of days later that I saw Hallie, and you two must communicate really well because Hallie already knew what was up. 

VR COUNSELOR: It has been a very valuable relationship, because there are a lot of things as a counselor that I am not equipped to be teaching or informing a client of. 

And there are so many side things that impact employment or getting to that job goal that having someone to support in figuring out resources or options or solutions to those areas, really increases the effectiveness of what I am doing. 

IL VR SPECIALIST: At some point during the first couple of meetings or anytime during the voc rehab process something comes up or the consumer says, well I don't know how to use the bus or I don't have health insurance. 

You know, my doctor said I should think about applying for Social Security benefits. 

And so there are these kind of triggers that the counselors hear and at that point you introduce my program and my services here. 

Ask if they are interested. 

Me being here addressing some of the barriers just really allows them to focus on their job and education with you, like I mentioned before because that is the goal and you know you having that education and that experience providing the counseling while I am working on the barriers and building up the independent living skills, I think just makes overall for a better program for everybody, for the consumer. 

MATTHEW COLLINS: Well I know that I would have hit a lot more roadblocks had these two not been there to help me. 

No, it definitely helps knowing that I have you two in my corner. 

Anytime I know that there is an issue that pops up, I can contact either one of you and that is helpful, just knowing that. 

ANNOUNCER: Matthew plans to spend two years in community college, then transfer to the University of Minnesota where he will complete a four-year degree that will prepare him for a technology career at a nonprofit organization. 

DAVE HANCOX: You saw my contact information from one of the earlier presentations, but there is Abbie's as well. 

Judith... 

JUDITH HOLT: We have time for a couple of questions. 

DAVE HANCOX: We're going to go to somebody else. 

Your questions are fantastic, but I want to give somebody else a chance. 

AUDIENCE MEMBER: I'm curious about 2007, the situation we have in Indiana right now is awkward for our coordination between IL and VR because we don't have independent living coverage in all 92 counties in Indiana so when we go to vocational rehabilitation, they say, great. 

You're fantastic where we can work with you, but what about these other 42 counties? 

Did Minnesota have full coverage at the time and how did you get by that? 

DAVE HANCOX: Good question, at the time we started this collaboration in 2007, we had all our counties covered except for 11. 

We have 87 counties in the state of Minnesota, and we had all of them covered by ILs except for 11. 

What we've been able to do through the IL VR collaboration is while we might not, actually it's the collaboration that has helped us close those gaps. 

Because we may not have the level of coverage that we would want in those 11 counties now, but what we do have is at least intermittent service through the collaborations that get us into those counties at least on an intermittent basis. 

Then we're working, the centers that are most closely related to those vacant counties or whose service areas butt up against those are now able to at least have some kind of intermittent service in there and our next phase of development called for in our state plan because we work very closely with the SILC on all this as well is that once we get each of the centers, the eight existing centers up to a minimum level of $500,000 in combined state and federal dollars, then the next phase calls for the development of at least one or two additional CILs in Minnesota. 

So that's part of that evolution that we're addressing. 

Good question though. Yes sir. Daryll. 

AUDIENCE MEMBER: What's your relationship with the kids in the foster care system? 

Because there is a lot of folks, you know, is there any interplay with foster homes? 

DAVE HANCOX: That's a really good question as well, Daryll. 

The relationship at least with the Metro center that we have with kids in the foster care system is via the school districts or through VR. 

We don't have a direct connect to them at this point. 

So we connect with them through those other two portals. 

AUDIENCE MEMBER: I'd like to know about case load size and how those staff are able to, the IL staff are able to keep up with all of the VR staff that are being referred to them? 

DAVE HANCOX: And Abbie may want to address this as well. 

Every person who comes to the VR counselor isn't automatically referred to IL. 

So it's not, we don't share the totality of that case load. 

[00:45:29.12] Through our project, we see probably between 1,000 and 1,200 individuals 

[00:45:33.97] per year, and we may not carry them for a long time. 

We'll meet their IL needs or get them to that point of where the consumer is satisfied with the completion of that task or that goal and then we move on to the next person. 

So the fact that we get a referral, we might not be, it might be as short as a month, it might be six months, it might be a year. 

It might be somebody who carries over to the next year, but it varies in length. 

But it is not an exact pair, every person that you guys see is not automatically referred to us 

ABBIE WELLS HERZOG: It really depends on the need of the person. 

I know recently I referred over one of my guys I was working with for them to go through DB101 to look at how working would affect their benefits. 

So my young man and his mom made an appointment with Analise and they went in there and spent probably 45 minutes or an hour and they were done. 

So it's usually not a long term service. 

It's more of a problem solving service almost, or a need service so once the need is filled, then they're done with the client. 

DAVE HANCOX: The other dove tail that I would say to that is that once that individual has completed that experience at the workforce center, they are certainly welcomed and free to contact us for additional services directly at the CIL. 

They may not, they may complete their service regiment with VR and six months later might come to us with a completely different need. 

They might come to us and say, you know, what I went through that and got my services met but I'm feeling like there is still some interpersonal skill development I'd like to pursue. 

So we'll set them up in our peer mentoring program, or we might provide additional service to them in some other fashion. 

ABBIE WELLS HERZOG: I guess one of the other things is I was developing that relationship with the IL person on site in the voc rehab office has also led for them to be referred to services at MCIL like for the cooking class or, you know 

DAVE HANCOX: Driving skills. 

ABBIE WELLS HERZOG: Talk about your permit thing you just started. 

[The permit class. 

DAVE HANCOX: Well, for the drivers license, we started a class, because we have so many young people that want to get their drivers license and mom and dad are going, I don't know about that. 

We've start a class at the Metro center where students can study for their permit. 

We'll work with them on the book side of that, not the driving side, but the book side of that. 

JUDITH HOLT: I can just see Dave working on the driving side. 

That would be interesting. 

One more question and then we need to 

DAVE HANCOX: Got one over here. Yes, sir? 

AUDIENCE MEMBER: You said you have 42 centers, I'm sorry, 42 counties in your state? 

DAVE HANCOX: There are 87 counties in the state. 

There are 11 counties that currently are not served by a Center for Independent Living. 

Each of the eight centers in the state of Minnesota has a service area of between 7 and 9 counties. 

AUDIENCE MEMBER: And you said you're trying to get them up to 500,000 per. 

DAVE HANCOX: Correct. Minimum. 

AUDIENCE MEMBER: Minimum. 

And then finally, the areas that are being served by independent living specialists, is that money through Part C or Part B, how do you do that? 

DAVE HANCOX: The dollars that support this particular project or collaboration are VRS program dollars. 

You want to speak to that a little bit more? 

They are VR program dollars. 

ABBIE WELLS HERZOG: It's program dollars that were allocated specifically for the IL project. 

AUDIENCE MEMBER: But again, those areas 

DAVE HANCOX: They are federal dollars. 

AUDIENCE MEMBER: But those counties that are being covered, are they being covered again by Part C dollars or Part B dollars? 

DAVE HANCOX: Yes. 

AUDIENCE MEMBER: Which one?  Both? 

DAVE HANCOX: Both, yes. 

For example, at the Metro Center for Independent Living, we receive the VRS program dollars for this IL VR collaboration. 

I also receive Part C dollars and a state allocation to provide core services to my seven county Metro area. 

AUDIENCE MEMBER: How does the SILC play into all of that? 

In terms of deciding where those funds go? 

DAVE HANCOX: The SILC is not in place to design or to direct where those Part C dollars go. 

Although how those Part C dollars are spent and the prioritization of independent living services are what are contained in their state plan. 

So, for example, right now one of the major identifications in our state plan is home modifications and nursing home relocation services. 

So we work with them. 

The eight centers work collaboratively with the SILC to help move along those goals because they are mutual goals. 

We share those. 

But our funding doesn't flow through the SILC. 

So I mean they may make some of the dollars that the SILC receives separately. 

The centers for independent living might receive a small one time grants from them for different supports and that, but our core service dollars don't flow through the SILC. 

They flow through the Designated State Unit which in our state is VR. 

We are a 723 state, so we don't get our dollars directly from the feds. 

And we don't want to. 

We're just as happy not to. 

JUDITH HOLT: You had a question? 

AUDIENCE MEMBER: I do. Real short. 

The first one is are the IL VR specialists necessarily or usually people with disabilities? 

The second question is of the 23,508 hours mentioned on slide 16 and 22, my understanding was that those were all funded by DOR and all delivered by an IL VR specialist. 

And then the last question is probably the hardest, if California's version of the Minnesota association of CILs were to organize a meeting with California DOR about the virtues of holistic programs and collapsing the dichotomy between IL and vocational, who is the highest ranking big wig at Minnesota VR who would be willing to come and help preach the virtues of that? 

DAVE HANCOX: That last question would be Kim peck, the director of VR in the state of Minnesota and she was the impetus for getting this program started. 

She brought us all together. 

Your first question, I would say probably about 60 percent of our IL specialists that are embedded into the workforce centers are people with disabilities themselves.